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This is a strange and somewhat personal post, but I want to share something with you.
I have recently gone through some tremendous personal issues. Some of them were business related, some not. Most who know me would label me as the eternal optimist, so these dark days were dark. In hindsight I can see what I fundamentally lacked was hope. Hope my situation would improve. Hope that my situation wasn’t meaningless difficulty.
It was during this time that I met Tim.
Tim is, for lack of a better term, a modern day monk (without the mad kung-fu skillz). His full time occupation is pray-er. He literally goes to a place each day and prays for the whole day.
Tim, by coincidence, came to my office on probably the worst day of my life. He also brought two helpers with him. The three of them prayed for me.
I’ve prayed before and I’ve been prayed for before, and this was nothing like I have ever experienced. The three of them prayed in a manner that I can describe as nothing less than “powerful”. They not only prayed, but they also listened to God and gave me his answers. Answers not only to my immediate questions, but to ones I hadn’t even asked yet. They told me things going on in my life with pin point accuracy that I never shared with them (the two women had never met me before). They predicted the future that over the last 2 months has come to pass exactly, word for word, how they said.
I was so moved by this experience I decided to bring Tim in and share his gift with my software company. They too have been blown away by the tangible power of Tim and his prayer team. They now regularly ask for him to come into the office.
I then had Tim and friends come to the HK meeting and pray with us, and again it was a powerful incredible experience. Just ask any of the staff.
This is so good I can’t keep it to myself, so I am now making it available to you.
Maybe you are going through a difficult struggle with your marriage.
Maybe you are having a hard time finding work.
Maybe you are in the midst of a life altering decision.
Maybe you are experiencing phenomena you have no explanation for and need help.
Maybe you just don’t feel hope anymore.
Someone is there and can help. I have arranged for Tim, Carolynn, and Lynn to come in Monday evening Jul 26 from 7pm to 9pm to pray with you privately in the back. They are open and willing to pray for you for anything that is on your heart. They are happy to freely use their gift.
If all goes well on Monday we will make something like this available again. So even if you can’t make it out on Monday maybe you can catch the next one, or we can arrange a special time to meet with Tim.
I don’t know how people will react to this invitation. I hope you see where it is coming from: a desire to help for those who freely choose it. I hope people will take me up on it.
To give truth to him who loves it not is but to give him more plentiful material for misinterpretation. -- George MacDonald
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I'd be cautious about mixing business with religion.
I suppose the reaction most people would have depends entirely on if religion isn't in anyway pushed on the patrons, that people of all faiths, agnostics and atheists are fully welcome in the store without any preaching going on. Which I’m sure they are, I've seen no indication otherwise. If it's merely a kind gesture then I don’t see the problem.
Perhaps parental supervision or permission might be a good idea for the younger patrons. I say this because the last thing you want is a religious argument with an angry parent.
It’s free right?
I’d also like to think this thread doesn’t go the way of some other threads on here and turn into a flame war. I think regardless of your own religious beliefs that we can all agree that Thomas’ heart is in the right place. 
I bounce and cut off your head! Circle...got the new rules not sure how many points I have now. :P 2000 or so + points of Nids...some primed, some sort of stripped etc. 1000+ points of Chaos Marines. 2500+ points of Dark Savants. 3000+ points of Chaos Daemons...slowly...coming along.
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I think that is a great idea Thomas. I am sure a lot of folks would enjoy that and could probably use it. Everyone goes through trials and tribulations in their life and something like this could be a great boon.
Jeff, I don't think he is pushing it on anyone nor do I think the store pushes religion on anyone. The place is nothing but inviting to everyone and I don't see how offering this could hurt. He said it would be a private matter and I don't think it's required to do to shop or play at HK. Maybe I misunderstood your post but it seemed a bit defensive. I am sorry if that is not what you meant.
Thindol
There are two kinds of people: those who say to God, "Thy will be done," and those to whom God says, "All right, then, have it your way."
- C. S. Lewis
I am returning this otherwise good typing paper to you because someone has printed gibberish all over it and put your name at the top.
- An English Professor
To be willing to die for an idea is to set a rather high price on conjecture.
- Anatole France
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I don't think he's pushing it on anyone either. I was just stating what I think peoples reaction would be to the offer and I think those reactions depend on what I mentioned above. I'm very tolerant of the majority of beliefs. I don't think I was being defensive but rather preventative as I know how touchy people get with religion. I like the store and I like Thomas and I didn't want to see the thread go south. So my intention was to keep this a positive thing.
I did type it out at near 4 in the morning so if it doesn't make sense you know why! 
I bounce and cut off your head! Circle...got the new rules not sure how many points I have now. :P 2000 or so + points of Nids...some primed, some sort of stripped etc. 1000+ points of Chaos Marines. 2500+ points of Dark Savants. 3000+ points of Chaos Daemons...slowly...coming along.
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All I can say is WOW............. Let me start by saying your beliefs are your beliefs. Everyone is entitled to their beliefs. Me, I will come right out and say it "I don't belive in God." I understand you had a religious experience, and I understand your wanting to share it. To bring it into a place of business I just don't understand. I come to the Hobby Kingdom to socialize and to play games. If I wanted to practice religion I would go to church. Don't get me wrong, my children are raised Catholic. My wife is religious I just back her. My wife being a practising Catholic has even said "What are they doing bringing religion into a business." I am sure not many will speak up about this, do to them thinking that they will be shunned from the Hobby Kingdom. Many of times people have spoken up outside the Hobby Kingdom but are to scared to speak their minds in front of Hobby Kingdom staff.
miss-spelling is ma trade marc********************************************************************************************** Remember remember the fifth of November Gunpowder, treason and plot. I see no reason why gunpowder, treason Should ever be forgot... ************************************************************************************************ glory glory what a hell of a way to die. ********************************************************************************************* 'I swear by God this sacred oath: I will render unconditional obedience to Adolf Hitler, the Führer of the German Reich and people, Supreme Commander of the Armed Forces, and will be ready as a brave soldier to risk my life at any time for this oath. EVERY GERMAN SOILDER WAS TO TAKE THE OATH ***************************************************************** REMEMBER REMEMBER THE 5TH OF NOVEMBER
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smell my finger wrote:
All I can say is WOW............. Let me start by saying your beliefs are your beliefs. Everyone is entitled to their beliefs. Me, I will come right out and say it "I don't belive in God." I understand you had a religious experience, and I understand your wanting to share it. To bring it into a place of business I just don't understand. I come to the Hobby Kingdom to socialize and to play games. If I wanted to practice religion I would go to church. Don't get me wrong, my children are raised Catholic. My wife is religious I just back her. My wife being a practising Catholic has even said "What are they doing bringing religion into a business." I am sure not many will speak up about this, do to them thinking that they will be shunned from the Hobby Kingdom. Many of times people have spoken up outside the Hobby Kingdom but are to scared to speak their minds in front of Hobby Kingdom staff.
Ditto all that. This is really not an appropriate thing to promote at a place of business. I doubt anyone will be actively offended, but I think a fair number of people will share my extreme discomfort with this whole thing.
Whether your customers' mere comfort is a concern to you as the owner is entirely your business, but there it is.
"How did you know you weren't really going crazy?" "The voices in my head kept calling me Bruce." "Yeah, and?" "In my head, that's not what I call myself."
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Good for you Thomas for having the guts to share something that you believe in. I don't see how sharing something like this is inappropriate.
Lad I don't know where you've been but I see you won first prize
Nowadays we Scots don't play bagpipes to frighten our enemies, we do it to annoy our neighbours.
Always remember to pillage BEFORE you burn
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...............oOO...(_)...OOo..........
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I think it's great that Thomas is using The Hobby Kingdom as a place that people can meet with Tim. He is using the building, NOT the business. If people have issues with religion, or what Thomas is providing, that's your choice. Please don't ruin it for everyone else.
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SpectacledBare wrote:I think it's great that Thomas is using The Hobby Kingdom as a place that people can meet with Tim. He is using the building, NOT the business. If people have issues with religion, or what Thomas is providing, that's your choice. Please don't ruin it for everyone else.
This is posted under Hobby Kingdom -> Official -> News. That means he considers the announcement related to the business (and is not merely using the space). Thomas, like all employees, has a space set aside for non-HK-related personal posts, but that's not where this is posted.
And yes, where you post is important. When Thomas chose to talk to the community about his health initiative, he did it in his blog area. This is exactly where it belonged, as it was NOT Hobby Kingdom business. In his personal blog space, that post was merely a discussion and journal, there for anyone interested in reading it. If he'd posted the exact same thread here in the Official HK News area, the tenor of the post would change completely, simply due to the location; weight loss and healthy eating becomes Official HK Business, which can come across as a more aggressive campaign-- "Hey HK fatties! Drop the donuts and get on the treadmill!". Official store news is inherently supposed to be persuasive-- it's where they let customers know about activities and initiatives at the store, and implore the community to participate. Anything posted in this area is going to be seen in that light.
Again, as I said before, this isn't about being offended. It's merely a comfort-level thing-- religious prosletyzation simply doesn't belong as an official store announcement. HK isn't a church, it's a gaming club. I go there to make magic robots punch each other in the face. If this event is a success and Thomas begins to schedule more and more of them, ramping up the publicity (again, NOT assuming he'd switch to active recruitment; I'm not making a slippery-slope argument), that's going to make me start to feel uncomfortable in the store space. I don't like to hang out in places where I don't belong, and if HK becomes the Burlington hot spot for gaming and group prayer, then it's going to have become a place I won't feel comfortable hanging out.
So, in summary: I'm not uncomfortable with the announcement itself-- it's no more recruity than the health posts. I'm only uncomfortable with it being positioned as official store business, and I'm curious to know if that positioning was intentional or not. Thomas, did you mean this to be store business? Do you consider this a service that the business is offering? Or is it just something you're doing independantly, and merely using a space you have available to you, which happens to be the store?
"How did you know you weren't really going crazy?" "The voices in my head kept calling me Bruce." "Yeah, and?" "In my head, that's not what I call myself."
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captainspud wrote:SpectacledBare wrote:I think it's great that Thomas is using The Hobby Kingdom as a place that people can meet with Tim. He is using the building, NOT the business. If people have issues with religion, or what Thomas is providing, that's your choice. Please don't ruin it for everyone else.
This is posted under Hobby Kingdom -> Official -> News. That means he considers the announcement related to the business (and is not merely using the space). Thomas, like all employees, has a space set aside for non-HK-related personal posts, but that's not where this is posted.
And yes, where you post is important. When Thomas chose to talk to the community about his health initiative, he did it in his blog area. This is exactly where it belonged, as it was NOT Hobby Kingdom business. In his personal blog space, that post was merely a discussion and journal, there for anyone interested in reading it. If he'd posted the exact same thread here in the Official HK News area, the tenor of the post would change completely, simply due to the location; weight loss and healthy eating becomes Official HK Business, which can come across as a more aggressive campaign-- "Hey HK fatties! Drop the donuts and get on the treadmill!". Official store news is inherently supposed to be persuasive-- it's where they let customers know about activities and initiatives at the store, and implore the community to participate. Anything posted in this area is going to be seen in that light.
Again, as I said before, this isn't about being offended. It's merely a comfort-level thing-- religious prosletyzation simply doesn't belong as an official store announcement. HK isn't a church, it's a gaming club. I go there to make magic robots punch each other in the face. If this event is a success and Thomas begins to schedule more and more of them, ramping up the publicity (again, NOT assuming he'd switch to active recruitment; I'm not making a slippery-slope argument), that's going to make me start to feel uncomfortable in the store space. I don't like to hang out in places where I don't belong, and if HK becomes the Burlington hot spot for gaming and group prayer, then it's going to have become a place I won't feel comfortable hanging out.
So, in summary: I'm not uncomfortable with the announcement itself-- it's no more recruity than the health posts. I'm only uncomfortable with it being positioned as official store business, and I'm curious to know if that positioning was intentional or not. Thomas, did you mean this to be store business? Do you consider this a service that the business is offering? Or is it just something you're doing independantly, and merely using a space you have available to you, which happens to be the store?
This makes sense. To further that idea I think there should be a non-hobby kingdom news section. This post could be there and say if I organized a fund raiser for some event it could be posted there.
I think there could be a real divide in the customer base with situations such as this which is something I don't want to happen.
I bounce and cut off your head! Circle...got the new rules not sure how many points I have now. :P 2000 or so + points of Nids...some primed, some sort of stripped etc. 1000+ points of Chaos Marines. 2500+ points of Dark Savants. 3000+ points of Chaos Daemons...slowly...coming along.
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I was under the impression Tim was going to be back in the boardroom or somesuch, rather than in the store proper - only there if folks want to take advantage of his presence, rather than standing in the corner as we all play WM/H.
I think it's neat that Thomas is bringing Tim in for those who'd like to take advantage of him (not meaning that the way it sounds), and personally don't think it'll impact my enjoyment of WM/H night at all.
 Lost Hemisphere- Warmachine, VS System and other gaming bloggery
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captainspud wrote:This is posted under Hobby Kingdom -> Official -> News. That means he considers the announcement related to the business (and is not merely using the space). Thomas, like all employees, has a space set aside for non-HK-related personal posts, but that's not where this is posted.
You have a good point Spud. I didn't think about where it was posted, just the message.
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smell my finger wrote:
All I can say is WOW............. Let me start by saying your beliefs are your beliefs. Everyone is entitled to their beliefs. Me, I will come right out and say it "I don't belive in God." I understand you had a religious experience, and I understand your wanting to share it. To bring it into a place of business I just don't understand. I come to the Hobby Kingdom to socialize and to play games. If I wanted to practice religion I would go to church. Don't get me wrong, my children are raised Catholic. My wife is religious I just back her. My wife being a practising Catholic has even said "What are they doing bringing religion into a business." I am sure not many will speak up about this, do to them thinking that they will be shunned from the Hobby Kingdom. Many of times people have spoken up outside the Hobby Kingdom but are to scared to speak their minds in front of Hobby Kingdom staff.
Agree 100%. I am not trying to attack anyone's beliefs or lack thereof, but on the opposite side, would a religious-person feel comfortable playing games at HK knowing there was an atheist convention in the back room? As a non-religious individual, I am uncomfortable around groups of people practicing any faith. I have nothing wrong with them personally, just when practicing faith together. I'm sure some will say "Well then just don't participate" or "Just ignore them" but why should I have to do that? Would a devout Christian be comfortable near a group that was designed to spread that word that no god exists? I highly doubt it. On the opposite end, to an atheist, a group preaching the existance of something that he/she doesn't believe in is just as offensive/uncomfortable.
I also agree that having this as an official HK news thread makes it seem like official HK business. If this is not the case then the thread should be moved. If it is...well then that's a whole can of worms I'm not going to open.
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An interesting service to provide for your protestant Christian customers (and possibly a few if the more liberal Roman Catholics). Will you be doing the same for other religions?
"Youth ages, immaturity is outgrown, ignorance can be educated and drunkenness sobered, but stupid is forever" -- Aristophanes "NO!!! No capes!!!" E. Mode Rome did not build the greatest empire the world has ever seen by holding meetings, they did it by killing all those who opposed them. Real Warmachines weigh more than 20 tons and carry PPC's Zombie Research Society Because what you don't know CAN eat you.
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Ummm...i admit i am not the smartest person or indeed the most spiritual but i have a question (more out of confusion...)
How is a "holy man" going to be in the area doing his thing while people are playing FoW (not the most peaceful of games), playing WH40K (possibly the most amti-God game ever designed) and talking about DnD, which is polytheistic....well ok, that last one might work out....
Just seems a little odd to me. No offense against Tim or Tom or anyone else. I just can't get my head wrapped around the idea of a holy man mixing it up with the gaming community at the same time.
Hope for the best.
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A Kung-Fu monk would've been neat.
Because that's how I roll. Warhammer Fantasy
High Elves: 6000pts Beware the Angry Dragon!
Tomb Kings: 3500pts They're better then you think, honest!
Dark Elves: 5000pts New hawtness
40k
Orks: 5000pts It's a lot of boyz. And they're heavy. So they stay home. Poor Boyz
Flames of War
Italians: 3000pts Loving the new Afrika companies
Germans: 5000pts Anybody want some?
British Armour: 2000pts Yes. We really are that fast
Warmachine/Hordes
Cygnar/Mercs: 267pts + Casters 43% painted. Those new duplicate units for my tiers brought down the number. Almost got to 50%!
Skorne/Minions: 129pts +Warlocks These guys DO look freakin' sweet!
I'm painting stuff, come and mock..er.... motivate me!
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shrapnel wrote:
How is a "holy man" going to be in the area doing his thing while people are playing FoW (not the most peaceful of games), playing WH40K (possibly the most amti-God game ever designed) and talking about DnD, which is polytheistic....well ok, that last one might work out....
This is a fair logistical question, so I will answer it here:
It'll be in the back: what I call the workshop room or sometimes called the "overflow room".
It needs to be private and confidential, so it will never be in the open (gaming rooms, demo tables, in the midst of a game).
To give truth to him who loves it not is but to give him more plentiful material for misinterpretation. -- George MacDonald
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captainspud wrote:This is posted under Hobby Kingdom -> Official -> News. That means he considers the announcement related to the business (and is not merely using the space). Thomas, like all employees, has a space set aside for non-HK-related personal posts, but that's not where this is posted.
...
So, in summary: I'm not uncomfortable with the announcement itself-- it's no more recruity than the health posts. I'm only uncomfortable with it being positioned as official store business, and I'm curious to know if that positioning was intentional or not. Thomas, did you mean this to be store business? Do you consider this a service that the business is offering? Or is it just something you're doing independantly, and merely using a space you have available to you, which happens to be the store?
I could have answered any of the people's posts on this thread, I just happened to pick Spud's. I hope my answer covers the other people's questions.
1. All constructive criticism is considered. The comfort of the customer's is of high importance and considered at great length. I did know not all people would be comfortable with the idea as an idea. As far as implementation goes, we will do our best tonight to make this as unnoticable as possible for those who don't participate in it. And as welcoming as possible for those who do. Will we get it right? I dunno. Hope so!
2. I talked at length with the staff about this initiative and they are happy, excited, enthused to be able to offer a free service like this at our location. HK staff are behind this, this is not just another crazy idea by Thomas, though I did initiate the idea.
I see the difference like this:
I talked about my calorie counting on my blog as there is no announcement for the store, it's just personal thoughts.
If I had of hired a trainer, say Derrick, and wanted people to experience a Boot Camp workout for free in the HK space (or nearby), I would announce it in the news section as a service available to the customer base of the HK.
I have arranged for Tim to come to the HK and do what he does best: pray with people. Its available to one and all.
3. Prayer has already happened with customers in the HK. If you didn't know/notice, then we've done a good job of making all people comfortable and respecting confidentiality. I'm simply taking something ad-hoc and putting a little bit more structure around it (day/time).
4. Will it happen more? We'll see how things go tonight.
5. Representation of other faiths/denominations? I spoke only from my personal experience. Is calorie counting the only way to lose weight? I dunno, worked for me. It is the one I'm most intimately familiar with and can share with others. Tim is a personal friend and is willing to do this. Worked for me, might for you. People may not be happy with this answer. Sorry. Try sitting at your desk and answering one of the thorniest issues of all time!
To give truth to him who loves it not is but to give him more plentiful material for misinterpretation. -- George MacDonald
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Snake Eyes wrote:A Kung-Fu monk would've been neat.
I want to watch that show but can not think of the name
miss-spelling is ma trade marc********************************************************************************************** Remember remember the fifth of November Gunpowder, treason and plot. I see no reason why gunpowder, treason Should ever be forgot... ************************************************************************************************ glory glory what a hell of a way to die. ********************************************************************************************* 'I swear by God this sacred oath: I will render unconditional obedience to Adolf Hitler, the Führer of the German Reich and people, Supreme Commander of the Armed Forces, and will be ready as a brave soldier to risk my life at any time for this oath. EVERY GERMAN SOILDER WAS TO TAKE THE OATH ***************************************************************** REMEMBER REMEMBER THE 5TH OF NOVEMBER
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smell my finger wrote:Snake Eyes wrote:A Kung-Fu monk would've been neat.
I want to watch that show but can not think of the name
It's just called 'Kung fu'
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michenerj wrote:smell my finger wrote:Snake Eyes wrote:A Kung-Fu monk would've been neat. I want to watch that show but can not think of the name It's just called 'Kung fu'
Thanks John
miss-spelling is ma trade marc********************************************************************************************** Remember remember the fifth of November Gunpowder, treason and plot. I see no reason why gunpowder, treason Should ever be forgot... ************************************************************************************************ glory glory what a hell of a way to die. ********************************************************************************************* 'I swear by God this sacred oath: I will render unconditional obedience to Adolf Hitler, the Führer of the German Reich and people, Supreme Commander of the Armed Forces, and will be ready as a brave soldier to risk my life at any time for this oath. EVERY GERMAN SOILDER WAS TO TAKE THE OATH ***************************************************************** REMEMBER REMEMBER THE 5TH OF NOVEMBER
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Well I wish I was a space marine. How is that for a wrench in the gears!
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story wrote:Well I wish I was a space marine. How is that for a wrench in the gears!
A little stupid? I mean, you'd be hard-wired into the suit, never be able to take it off, and your only achievements in life would be xenophobic slaughter, and eventually you'd die on some unnamed planet.
Lost Hemisphere- Warmachine, VS System and other gaming bloggery
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... Even if I was a space wolf? I thought they are the only ones who arent hard-wired/ only ones that eat real food?
Oh geeze... okay well how about an imperial psycher then?
www.crossedsabres.caNo One Gets Left Behind! Chaos Warriors - 6000 pts. Eldar - 2250 pts.
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Yabo wrote:captainspud wrote:This is posted under Hobby Kingdom -> Official -> News. That means he considers the announcement related to the business (and is not merely using the space). Thomas, like all employees, has a space set aside for non-HK-related personal posts, but that's not where this is posted.
...
So, in summary: I'm not uncomfortable with the announcement itself-- it's no more recruity than the health posts. I'm only uncomfortable with it being positioned as official store business, and I'm curious to know if that positioning was intentional or not. Thomas, did you mean this to be store business? Do you consider this a service that the business is offering? Or is it just something you're doing independantly, and merely using a space you have available to you, which happens to be the store?
I could have answered any of the people's posts on this thread, I just happened to pick Spud's. I hope my answer covers the other people's questions.
1. All constructive criticism is considered. The comfort of the customer's is of high importance and considered at great length. I did know not all people would be comfortable with the idea as an idea. As far as implementation goes, we will do our best tonight to make this as unnoticable as possible for those who don't participate in it. And as welcoming as possible for those who do. Will we get it right? I dunno. Hope so!
2. I talked at length with the staff about this initiative and they are happy, excited, enthused to be able to offer a free service like this at our location. HK staff are behind this, this is not just another crazy idea by Thomas, though I did initiate the idea.
I see the difference like this:
I talked about my calorie counting on my blog as there is no announcement for the store, it's just personal thoughts.
If I had of hired a trainer, say Derrick, and wanted people to experience a Boot Camp workout for free in the HK space (or nearby), I would announce it in the news section as a service available to the customer base of the HK.
This is a satisfactory response.
Oh and excuse me from earlier today when we met in the store I had trouble hearing you and after you left I realized what you actually said. So that's why I made no sense.
Not that I ever do.
I have arranged for Tim to come to the HK and do what he does best: pray with people. Its available to one and all.
3. Prayer has already happened with customers in the HK. If you didn't know/notice, then we've done a good job of making all people comfortable and respecting confidentiality. I'm simply taking something ad-hoc and putting a little bit more structure around it (day/time).
4. Will it happen more? We'll see how things go tonight.
5. Representation of other faiths/denominations? I spoke only from my personal experience. Is calorie counting the only way to lose weight? I dunno, worked for me. It is the one I'm most intimately familiar with and can share with others. Tim is a personal friend and is willing to do this. Worked for me, might for you. People may not be happy with this answer. Sorry. Try sitting at your desk and answering one of the thorniest issues of all time!
I bounce and cut off your head! Circle...got the new rules not sure how many points I have now. :P 2000 or so + points of Nids...some primed, some sort of stripped etc. 1000+ points of Chaos Marines. 2500+ points of Dark Savants. 3000+ points of Chaos Daemons...slowly...coming along.
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